Heroes Fall Finale!!!

while we're nearly liveblogging Heroes, please note that we need 2 pts from the Eagles Defense tonite. Fly Eagles Fly!!!

1:00 - wait, i have to get some more Dr L. this figures to be unbearable otherwise.

2:00 - CB Note: J made me pause right after the "previously ons" to talk football on the phone. Let's gooooooooooo!

3:00 - it was totes awesome when sylar offed Arthur P, i will admit that. loved seeing that again.

4:00 - cb notes that sylar is narrating. does this mean mohinder will die?!

5:00 - why is nathan so dumb to keep following this plan? like seriously, did he miss season 1? he was manipulated all season, and did the right thing at the end, barely.

6:00 - still unexplained is how peter will get his powers back. also, it would be awesome if peter busted a cap in nathan's ass. nice trick punch petey!

7:00 - overheard on the couch at 46 and 1, "peter, you used to be my favorite!"
CB Note: After the ep, when they did the preview for the next chapter, they showed Peter from season 1...he was so emotive! he was so genuine! he didn't talk in a batman-like snarl! Oh season 1 Peter, how I miss you...

8:00 - how is sylar at primatech? he was just at pinehearst.
RK Note: This is an excellent question, he doesn't have Hiro's, Daphne's or Nathan's abilities, or anything like them, does he?

9:00 - what is this "i'm gonna prove you're all monsters like me" talk? we dont understand.
RK Note: Has anyone else seen Saw? Did anyone else think that Sylar's scheme was a LOT like Jigsaw's schemes in the Saw movies?
CB Note: Saw is NOT my kind of movie...

10:00 - thanks claire for that get you in the back of the head reminder from season 1. i had forgotten that, since it'd been 6 minutes since i saw arthur get killed like that.
LB Note: Arthur was killed because the Haitian was holding off his powers, not because he was shot in the back of the head...
RK Note: Then why didn't he heal once the Haitian left?
CB Note: Arthur was killed because the Haitian was holding off his powers so that he could be shot in the head. We've learned that people who can heal, (Peter, Claire, Sylar...) can only die if shot/stabbed in the head - if whatever it was was removed from their head, they could then heal, a la Claire in season one when she had that branch in her head and woke up after it was removed during her autopsy.

11:00 - also... who are sylar's real parents? or was he all genetically hatched like ali larter?

12:00 - cb thinks hiro woulda fallen by now.
RK Note: I agree. He also righted himself on top of that flagpole WAY too effortlessly. Very unrealistic. Not that any of the show is at all realistic, or supposed to be at all realistic...
LB Note: Hiro looks like the bastion of upper body strength...


13:00 - how did arthur know to go back and get the formula from hiro? did he paint it isaac style?

14:00 - what are these 2 bad guys doing? who are they with?

15:00 - L.O.L. at fear guy instakilling that marine.
LB Note: This scene was absolutely hilarious. Though I kinda feel bad for the marine who like watched his friends die and is now having his neck snapped by creepy fear dude.
CB Note: The only thing I didn't like about this was that I totally wanted their plans with the super strong soldiers to go awry and blow up in their faces by the strong men turning on them.

16:00 - was it really that easy to get rid of all the formula?

17:00 - cb asks, and i agree, how ridiculous is it that ando thinks he's gonna get to time travel? do you just get to pick your power? i mean, seriously, what ridiculousness.

18:00 - good point parkman, we agree! lol.

19:00 - daphne actually just tried to argue that you get the power you want (cripple to being fast bc she wanted to run). are we really supposed to take that brief explanation to parkman's question (asked for the audiences sake) as the answer? - did peter really wanted to absorb other peoples power? nathan really wanted to fly? parkman really wanted to read his cheating wife's thoughts? fear guy really wanted to be powerful from other peoples fears? and micah really wanted most of all to be able to withdraw all the money he wanted from ATMs????

20:00 - also, cb keeps unpausing and not giving me a chance to type, and then complaining bc i'm blogging. She's the one who wanted me to blog to begin with!!!
CB Note: You have to give the people what they want! Think of all the joy you spread with your blog! I think you should blog more often!
RK Note: Please, please, PLEASE blog Y&R. And every ANTM.
LB Note: Umm, learn how to type faster...

21:00 - also, so, now ando has powers? there goes the kind of cool thing of having some people without powers.
LB Note: I'm fine with Ando having powers now that Hiro has no powers...

22:00 - lol that sure was easy for hiro to climb up... didn't look it from the other views.

23:00 - cb thinks hiro will have to get help from his dad.

24:00 - wise words from little hiro. i wonder if hiro is gonna get rid of the formula now, and then instachange the future. i hate how you cant blog during hiro scenes, bc you're not reading the screen. cb used to be better at reading it out loud to me.

25:00 - btw, if its so easy for hiro like this, why didn't he just teleport back to cheaply save the world in seasons 1 and 2? (ie, by killing exploding guy so he could never give sylar his power, or by [we tried to figure out what the plot of season 2 was to give an example, but neither of us remembered. something about a little indian girl virus? and some plot with mohinder seeing images of her in dreams or india that was just spontaneously dropped???)

26:00 - witty repartee between claire and angie there (temper tantrums and spankings)

27:00 - with sylar so dangerous, why did angela want to play games with him being a company agent? why not just kill him? wouldn't that have been smarter? he better have like some super important role to explain such silliness. cb asks what the end game was for the whole "family" plan that both her and arthur tried to use.
CB Note: She was just trying to use him as a weapon - get the scary killer on your side so he's with you, not against you. But how'd Arthur know she was lying to Sylar about it when they first saw each other and said he also told Sylar he was his dad. Damn that Arthur.
LB Note: Angela is a manipulator. That's what she does. She's also eerily calm during this entire scene while everyone else is running around freaking out!
CB Note: Angela IS always calm!!! No matter what the situation. How odd.


28:00 - those are some loud ticking clocks!!!! is this how claire becomes a villain (peters original future that really doesn't matter anymore)?! omg no she shot the phone instead, and then delivered a brilliant "you are". i was on the edge of my seat.... really... . ok, i was just reaching for the wineglass, but still.
CB Note: I believe I mentioned at this point that it seemed like a waste of a bullet, since she only had 6

29:00 - a) i cant believe the plan was to let all (3) villains out? also, why didn't he just puppet them both?
RK Note: I was SO AFRAID he was going to just puppet them all!!!! Why didn't he just immediately puppet everyone?!?! I hate him and he terrifies me. He also sort of reminds me of my 1L Legal Writing professor.
LB Note: I figured he'd die pretty quickly like fear dude "instakilled" the marine...


30:00 - cb hates puppetmaster. i say, at least he doesn't shoot fire.
CB Note: He's SO creepy
LB Note: Puppetmaster could use some of the sexual harrassment training I had in my office. We watched some very informative vignettes.

31:00 - caryn wonders if mohinder is dead. i say it doesnt matter, bc hiro is gonna change the past and render this entire season moot.
CB Note: I think the correct word is "hoped" ...caryn hoped mohinder might finally be offed.
RK Note: Rachel hoped, too.

32:00 - i will say, this daphne-parkman-ando scene with the scrunching was comedy gold.

34:00 - cb thinks that glowing red ando hand is the ability he had when he killed hiro. now.... THAT... would be awesome, and maybe even reinstore a little faith in the plotting ability of the writers. ok, so i was looking to see where above i wrote that it would be kinda awesome if they at least went back to the ando v hiro fight, but i couldn't find it. i swear, i thought it. while i was looking, cb mentioned how Heroes is sloppy with its past-present-future effects, unlike B2F 1 and 2. i pointed her towards the entry at 31:00. totes agree!
LB Note: The problem with the theory that this is the power that he kills Hiro with is that the power supposedly magnifies other people's powers. I think that scene was a false future bc it appeared that Hiro had powers in it and now he doesn't. Plus, wouldn't using his powers on Hiro just amplify Hiro's powers, not kill him...
RK Note: He wasn't REALLY killing him, see Caryn's note how it just looked like it at 56:00-- in the future he was supercharging Hiro, but when Hiro saw the future vision before knowing of the existence of Ando's future-acquired ability, he thought it was killing and didn't realize it was supercharging. This is all theory since I didn't rewatch the scene to confirm it was the same zapping thing going on, but I like Caryn's theory on it at 56:00! Also it could be a future that still happens if Hiro gets his powers back, which he may be able to somehow still... He could always go back in time and grab some of the formula to inject himself with (or roll around in like Mohinder).

34:00 - for rachel, B2F = back to the future.
RK Note: Thanks for the shoutout

35:00 - every great B level horror flick needs a still moving decapitated arm.
RK Note: Yet another similarity between this episode and the Saw movies.

36:00 - a) i cant believe sylar could lose to the puppetmaster. b) how could the puppetmaster be so dumb not to insta kill sylar, why talk like a dummy?

37:00 - bye claire's mom. its ok though, you were mostly useless.
RK Note: I hope getting rid of Jessalyn Gilsig was only to free up her schedule to go back to Nip/Tuck as Gina
LB: I still think Claire could have absorbed all fo the fire and healed from the burns...
RK Note: GREAT point, if she could somehow have absorbed it all without the company blowing up... Also in this scene I was irrationally worried about Claire getting out before the building exploded, when clearly it doesnt matter since she could have healed anyway!!!
CB Note: I still think that the Fire is not the same as the Electricity that Claire absorbed from Elle. Elle was electrocuting the plane and held Claire's hand too electrocute Claire. It wasn't Claire "absorbing" it exactly, it was just that she could be electrocuted and survive. Claire's mom was going to explode, there's no way to "absorb" fire in the same way, because even if she burned Claire, she was still going to explode.
LB Note Rejoinder: While I understand what you are saying, if I remember correctly, Elle's problem was that she could no longer control her powers. It's the same problem as biomom. Elle was sparking when she got angry; biomom was shooting flames bc of the adrenaline. If she had just shot fire into Clare until the effects of the adrenaline wore off...
CB Note Rejoinder: I agree that both were a result of the person not being able to control the power, but I believe that is the difference in the 2 powers that is the reason it can't be done! Fire and electricity are different in how they work, fire doesn't have the same ability to transfer to a different object like electricity can.

38:00 - ohnoes, she cant control her fire, she's gonna asplode!! recycle season 1 more pls.

39:00 - sylar is devious. at least they've explained his earlier line. he is trying to force them all into bad situations and make them do terrible things, like hrg and elle did to him.

40:00 - i know that was obvi, but rachel was probably texting and emailing, so i wanted to make sure she got it. Also, titus pollo is in the legion with lucius vorenus.
RK Note: I don't text and e-mail during HEROES, just terrible boring confusing HBO shows. I couldn't pick Titus Pollo out of a lineup if my life depended on it. I didn't even like Rome the city that much when I visited it. Also I got a B in Jeremy McInierny's Introduction to Ancient Rome class, and perhaps my bitterness over that is what led to my aversion to all things Rome-related in my future. OR, perhaps that class was more boring than the HBO show Rome. Actually, not possible.

41:00 - note though, that lucius is now making out with Arliss' former assistant on thursday nites on abc.
RK Note: Luckily that wouldn't confuse me because I'd never recognize Lucius. At least not Lucius from Rome. I'd know Lucius Malfoy anywhere.

42:00 - Assante Samuel Pick 6! 3 Superbowls next week! Blondies West at 1pm, make sure to rsvp!

43:00 - terrible nathan/fear dialogue.

44;00 - well, rough end for fear guy. he was mostly a pointless character. just some random 'muscle' ali larter is backkkkkkkkkkkkkkk.

45:00 - ooooooh, at least ando's new power is kinda funky! well, actually, apparently he sends OTHER PEOPLE back in time. nifty i guess. does make the time traveler total 2 though. closing in on fire throwers!

46:00 - i love how ticking clocks are season 3's way overused sound effect in the vein of micah's ATM theme music.
RK Note: What HAPPENED to Micah??? And to that little girl who could find anyone?

47:00 - you are KIDDING me lol. the gun didn't do it, so we got claire running throught the glass? what silliness. i feel like every scene centered on trying to make claire a hero is TERRIBLE. so are her terrible one liners. she'd be better off saving dolphins in japan.

48:00 - right ali, all you need is the document with the formula. who needs the catalyst? the last 3 episodes were so bad, lets just pretend they never happened. good plan ali.
LB Note: Shouldn't they just make a pdf version of the formula and e-mail it to themselves...
RK Note: Seriously, or even a low tech Xerox? Make just a few copies? Even handwritten copies? Someone with the power of photographic memory could just memorize it, its only a sheet of paper long! SOMETHING, people!

48:00 - rachel, skip the entries at 49:00 and 52:00.

49:00 - ok, so now they are going with the supercharger theory for ando's power. now, this was my first guess, though i didnt write it [CB Note: As J likes to say, Screenshot or it didn't happen!], when parkman could hear everything in nyc, and daphne moved realllllllllllly fast. but then, to explain, daphne's time travel, back they go all "you were moving so fast you went back in time, its einstein's theory of relativity!!!!" Well, listen up you pathetic lamers, im not a physicist, but i did read some physics books for popular consumption [CB Note: Nerd!], and the only time travel happening when you move at speeds approaching the speed of light is that time moves slower for you (bc your energy is spent so much moving through space, that less is moving through time, conceptually), so that if you go traveling at the speed of light for a few years, then come back to earth, you will yourself not actually have aged even though years have gone by, and everyone else will have aged, so it will feel like time travel, but you never actually literally go backwards. thats just pathetic hocus pocus. in other words, par for the Heroes course.
CB Note: Mumbo Jumbo. I'm fine with thinking that Daph/Ando can move fast enough to go through time. It's Heroes after all, not exactly the source of realistic plots.

50:00 - all that said, supercharging is a cool ability. but this whole supercharging daphne back thing is ridiculous. and, as caryn notes, what will she do for 16years once shes back there? it will be cool if she meets her "nemesis" in the past though, bc hiro daph scenes are usually actually good.
CB Note: Well, I had just wondered if it worked both ways, she could travel back and forth through time, which obviously, she did. Cause it would have been funny if it worked backwards and then they were stuck :)

51:00 - why not just tell him you are hiro?
CB Note: I agree! It's not like his dad doesn't know about powers. His mom believed him when he told him. If he had told him what happened in the future, maybe he would have agreed to destroy it, rather than just hide the two halves.



52:00 - ok, so, my first thought was, daphne mucked it up and now its not destroyed. then cb noted that it was ripped in half in the future, the 2 halves. so.... kudos to the writers for not taking the easy "hiro just goes back and fixes it path." On the other hand, if it was already ripped in 2 halves in the episode we first saw, that seems to suggest the kind of timetravel universe where the timetraveling is already taken into account. this, of course, was decidedly NOT the case with arthur, who obviously was NOT the catalyst originally. So... well done writers, way to use two theories of how to reconcile time travel paradoxes, and sub them in and out as you need.
CB Note: As I explained to J after seeing him type the above...it was PRESENT arthur who went back in time, became the catalyst, and then returned to the present to activate the formula. As opposed to PAST arthur taking the catalyst and having had it all the time, the past 16 years. So throughout this season, arthur never had the catalyst, until the point he went back in time, got it, and returned. Really no one was the catalyst for those 16 years in between.

RK Note: YES, YES, YES. Caryn explains this brilliantly.

53:00 - rachel, you should skip the entries at 52:00 and 49:00. actually, this wont do you any good now. let me go add it in at 48:00.

54:00 - cb has a nuanced take on the issue in 52:00, which i think is s pretty persuasive response. im impressed. kudos to her. ill let her add it in a cb note.

55:00 - so now, they are going to get the formula again at pinehearst? tbh... i would just dash back in time to the moment before hiro got caught and destroy the formula.

56:00 - awesome note by cb, although we cant remember the dialogue, its likely that ando was never killing hiro, but just supercharging him in the future. well done babe! cb just suggested going online to watch it after. mayhaps we will.
RK Note: Such a good nut!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

57:00 - cb wants to note that i am 10 minutes ahead on my minutes numbers, and have been all ep.

58:00 - ohnoes! they spilled a vat of formula all over the floor and mohinder drank some and woke up.

59:00 - nathan is such a patsy. btw, is peter gonna inject himself? lol good thing there was one syringe left. cb and i wonder if peter will get his absorption power back, or all the old ones he collected too. well, he can fly!
RK Note: Such a good point, if it just gives back his power to absorb abilities, how can he fly? Maybe because Nathan was there? Or does he still have all past absorbed abilities?
CB Note: We think Peter regained his ability to absorb other powers, but not the powers he had previously. So, he got Nathan's power cause he was in the same room as Nathan. But he still needs to be near other people to get their powers again.

60:00 - mohinder is trapped in the lab fire. cb cheers his imminent death. i preemptively cry at his unlikely escape.

61:00 - two thumbs up for animated john hodgman!
CB Note: For those who don't know...that was a reference to the Animated "I'm a Mac" commercial that we stopped to watch because who doesn't love claymation?!

62:00 - she gave him love and guidance like a mother? for what, 2 episodes?
CB Note: Perhaps we will learn that when Sylar was a baby the Petrelli's took care of him before giving him to his adoptive family? Would be more satisfying than her pretending to be his mom for a few eps.

63:00 - angela is sylar's mother... true or false? survey sayyyyyyyyyyyys..... shes not!

64:00 - ooh.. perhaps an explanation to our earlier question... what skill of sylar's did angela need? uh oh... who are sylar's real parents.............. sounds like a plot for next season tbh...

65:00 - unless... of course... claire offs sylar this episode....

66:00 - whoa... is that really the end of sylar???
CB Note: I would hope not! Maybe after the fire, someone finds Sylar, takes the glass out of his brain, then he will heal a la claire on the autopsy table in season 1.
RK Note: I love Sylar, he can't be gone!!!

67:00 - just let her die claire. nobody cares about her. seriously.

68:00 - so... im supposed to feel all emotional at claires bio mom dying.. i know thats what they are going for... and... i just think its funny and im glad shes dead. seriously... terribly written, not emotional investment. just a sign of bad writing and terrible plotting.
CB Note: I am happy that they're killing a bunch of non-essential characters this ep, so they can start next season off with fewer people, which has been a complaint of Heroes - too many people, too many storylines. They really just need the few ones that we like and one central storyline (that makes more sense).

69:00 - and even cb criticized the needless exploding special effects.

70:00 - cb notes that peters scar isnt healed in this scene with nathan. that would indicate he just can fly and do blue fire now...

71:00 - cb laughed at my 71:00.

72:00 - oh no, mohinder is narrating again. how did he live?!?!?! this isnt gonna be surprising, but id really have preferred if sylar lived and mohinder died...

73:00 - whats mohinder doing with ali.

74:00 - this mohinder narration is just so lame. these things used to be kinda cool in season 1.
CB Note: That's cause we liked Mohinder in season 1. Imagine that!

75:00 - thats it, really? pathetic.

76:00 - cb makes an amazing note! sylar was alive in the future. only now, as i try to explain how great a nut it was, she fights with me about time travel theories and doesn't let me write it bc she wont pause

77:00 - the thing from fugitives was cool. cb nutted the plot of Fugitives.

78:00 - to continue 76:00, sylar cant be dead. bc, as per the first part of 52:00 (cb's cb note to come will explain away the contradictory theories), the future takes into account the past, and sylar was VERY MUCH alive in the future, earlier this season, and as good sylar (did he turn good after finally meeting his parents?). i was going to debate this point with cb, but she shushed me and wouldn't keep it paused.
CB Note: My issue with this was that I think there might be a difference between the PRESENT reflecting things that have happened in the past and when they travel/see visions of the FUTURE, because it is a possible future and once they see what happens, they can change it (because it has not yet happened). Just like in season one, where they went into the future and saw Manhattan all blown up. They saw what COULD happen, went back to the present, and averted it. Then, the future changed. This season, FUTURE peter went back in time because he saw what happened after injecting others with powers. So now, that is averted and that future will no longer happen. So what I'm saying is, while I would love for Sylar to be alive and hopefully be a good guy in the future, it's not necessarily going to happen anymore, since he could very well be dead permanently. Also, as a side note, I'm pretty sure that in that future, Sylar still thought Peter was his brother, meaning in the timeline that lead to that future, he hadn't attacked HRG/found out he wasn't their child/gotten the Lie Detector ability.

79:00 - also i forgot to write about my complaint that daphne and hiro just dashed back to the future. also impossible by their supercharged relativity theory. in actualty, to dash forward like that, they'd have to run at the speed of light for 16 years measured by our lives (ie 16 lightyears), which would allow them to not have aged at all for 16 years when they do go back to moving normally through space.
CB Note: Blah blah blah dork.

80:00 - also, in season one sylar was alive in the future and masquerading as president petrelli, remember that awesome episode then when he fought peter. obviously, we are to assume that this future was averted, but its not under the "thats why the formula was in 2 halves already theory" of time travel.
CB Note: See 78:00 CB Note pls!